21 Feb 1999: uk.local.southwest.adverts

From: Barry Salter <b.salter@ukvoting.org.uk>
Date: 21 Feb 1999 12:27:36 -0000
Subject: RESULT - Create uk.local.southwest.adverts PASSES 28:16
Newsgroups: None



	Summary: Creating new newsgroup uk.local.southwest.adverts

	 Create newsgroup uk.local.southwest.adverts PASSES 28:16


Voting closed at 23:59:59 GMT, 15th February 1999

Proponent: Tim Miller <tm6248@bristol.ac.uk>
Votetaker: Barry Salter <b.salter@ukvoting.org.uk>


uk.net.news.announce, uk.net.news.config, uk.local.southwest


The Results:

The results follow below in the following order:

1) Result
2) Particulars of the Vote
3) Votetakers comments
4) Voting and Appeal guidelines
5) Rationale & Newsgroup charter

PROPOSAL - Create newsgroup uk.local.southwest.adverts

    YES = 28 = 60.9%
     NO = 16 = 34.8%
ABSTAIN =  2 =  4.3%

YES beat NO by a majority of 12 votes, this is more than the +12
majority required to beat the status quo.


uk.local.southwest.adverts Final Vote Ack

Voted Yes : 28 votes (60.9%)
al~#~eschaton.demon.co.hx (Al Howat)                          
andywood~#~dial.pipex.pbz (Andy Wood)                         
angus-fraser~#~dial.pipex.pbz (Angus Fraser)                  
billyboy~#~gto.net.bz (Bill Davies)                           
chris.dennis~#~ndirect.co.hx (Chris Dennis)                   
clive~#~cmartin.demon.co.hx (Clive Martin)                    
dave~#~detankard.u-net.pbz (The Fourth Warrior)               
dave~#~pandroid.zetnet.co.hx (David Deans)                    
denis~#~chf.softnet.co.hx (Denis Fuller)                      
ellen~#~duff.bet (Ellen Stafford)                             
godfrey.room~#~virgin.arg (Godfrey S. Room)                   
grw~#~bedlam.u-net.pbz (The Ancient Geek)                     
james~#~schindler-ord.freeserve.co.hx (James)                 
jane~#~otbo.demon.co.hx (Jane Vernon)                         
jezza~#~hotwells.freeserve.co.hx (Jezza (Jeremy McNeill))     
jimavery~#~cableinet.co.hx (Jim Avery)                        
kandw~#~rocketmail.pbz (Bill)                                 
lb~#~pipponet.freeserve.co.hx (LB)                            
marysia~#~jadzia.demon.co.hx (Marysia)                        
mutley~#~schitzoid.clara.co.hx (Mutley)                       
spacker~#~iee.bet (Stephen Packer)                            
sue~#~hossackhouse.demon.co.hx (Sue H)                        
suze~#~theworkhouse1.demon.co.hx (Suze)                       
ted~#~the-pub3.demon.co.hx (Ted)                              
tfl~#~psp.co.hx (T Lee)                                       
tm6248~#~bristol.ac.hx (Tim Miller)                           
vinceh~#~softrock.co.hx (VinceH)                              
warren~#~gwtech.demon.co.hx (Warren Hoy)                      

Voted No : 16 votes (34.8%)
alanr~#~lightnet.co.hx (Alan Rayner)                          
alex.dawson~#~uea.ac.hx (Alex Dawson)                         
bryan~#~morris4.demon.co.hx (Bryan Morris)                    
conor~#~puddle.demon.co.hx (Conor O'Neill)                    
david.mayall~#~ukonline.co.hx (Dave Mayall)                   
ijackson~#~chiark.greenend.org.hx (Ian Jackson)               
james~#~obeah.demon.co.hx (James Coupe)                       
keith.willoughby~#~compaq.pbz (Keith Willoughby)              
lyn~#~stuffing.demon.co.hx (Lyn David Thomas)                 
mbm~#~acm.bet (Malcolm Mladenovic)                            
merlin~#~cvnet.co.hx (Darren Wyn Rees)                        
mike~#~tw2.pbz (Mike Henry)                                   
paul~#~pcserv.demon.co.hx (Paul Carpenter)                    
richard-vote~#~illuin.demon.co.hx (Richard Letts)             
richard~#~turnpike.pbz (Richard Clayton)                      
vote-uk~#~kholdan.snafu.qr (Tobias Erle)                      

Abstained : 2 votes (4.3%)
amabbett~#~bham-assist.demon.co.hx (Andy Mabbett)             
sjfb~#~cirra.pbz (SJFBeckwith)                                

Invalid Votes
bill_jillians~#~compuserve.pbz (Bill Jillians)
 ! No name or address on ballot paper


Votetakers Notes:

This was an extremely close vote right up to the close of voting, but
as you can see the group has passed by achieving the neccessary +12
majority, albeit barely.

There was only one invalid ballot paper received, as indicated above,
but the voter neglected to resubmit a valid vote.


This vote was conducted by a neutral third party member of UKVoting.
UKVoting is a group of independent votetakers who count votes 
on CFVs in
the uk hierarchy.  The rules under which this vote is taken are posted
regularly to uk.net.news.announce or can be found at the 
following URL:

The UKVoting web pages can be found at http://www.ukvoting.org.uk/

There is a five day discussion period after these results are 
posted to uk.net.news.announce.

Allegations of irregularity should be sent to control@usenet.org.uk.


RATIONALE: (including Summary of Discussion)

Of late the uk.* group uk.local.southwest has been receiving a lot of
attention from advertisers, both genuine local advertisers 
and corporate
spammers.  Because of this almost all genuine advertisers have been
overlooked - this is a bad thing, since local 'for sale' 
adverts should be posted to a local, not national, group.

By creating a seperate newsgroup for adverts in the 
SouthWest, we hope to
ensure that local advertisers will not be deterred from 
contributing to
their local newsgroup, and, combined with the proposed altered
uk.local.southwest charter, the case for ISP intervention 
against spammers will be reinforced.

Also, the (existing) charter for uk.local.southwest indicates that
should postings exceed 30 a day, the newsgroup may be split.  
Postings do
indeed exceed this limit, and it is hoped by removing adverts and
complaints about adverts this total may fall.


Many posters replied to say they agreed with the proposals, 
and cited that
the newsgroup uk.l.sw (uk.local.southwest) has been besieged by spam
recently.  Also, when these advertisers were told to stop, 
they often turn
abusive.  As a result, proper local advertisers tended to get 

Many said that a local forum for advertising goods is a good idea, and
said they would prefer to look in a local rather than 
national paper, for example.

Several people (but not a majority) said that they supported 
a new local
adverts group, but they would prefer to have the group created in the
uk.adverts.* group (ie, uk.adverts.southwest).  There were a few valid
reasons for this view, but there were equally valid reasons for the
original proposal (equivalent to looking in a local paper, or 
at the local
section of a national paper). One person was against all proposals.



Newsgroups line:
uk.local.southwest.adverts      Adverts in the uk.local.southwest area

CHARTER: uk.local.southwest.adverts

uk.local.southwest.adverts is a local newsgroup intended for 
regarding local products for sale, local services, local theatre
productions (and other arts), and local companies (which do 
not wish to advertise outside the SouthWest).

For the purposes of this newsgroup the SouthWest is defined 
as including
Gloucestershire, Wiltshire, Bristol and Bath, Somerset, 
Dorset, Devon, and Cornwall.

Users should note the existance of the uk.adverts.* heirarchy 
and should
consider posting matters concerning products for sale 
nationwide to the
relevent group. Crossposting between uk.local.southwest.adverts and
uk.adverts.* is discouraged, as uk.local.southwest is 
intended for local adverts.

Private 'for sale' adverts may be posted a maximum of once a week.
Commercial adverts may be posted a maximum of once every three weeks.
Commercial adverts for the same company/service which are only worded
differently will be considered identical.


This is a adverts group, and so adverts are explicitly 
allowed.  There may
a moderate discussion about adverts that are posted; any further
discussion (over, for example, warnings of possible 
falsehoods in adverts)
should only be posted if there is reasonable evidence.

This is a UK newsgroup, and activities which are illegal under UK law
(including laws governing paper mail, such as chain email and 
multi-level marketing) must not be posted.


Binaries are not permitted; pointers to ftp or web sites may 
be posted.


- -- 
Barry K A Salter, b.salter@ukvoting.org.uk
Posting as a member of UKVoting
PGP Key ID: 0x02C5AC93, available from key servers

Version: 2.6


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